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This is the talk page for discussing WikiProject Australian rules football and anything related to its purposes and tasks.

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Sydney Swans on the to do list

We're apparently missing two articles, Reuben Cooper and Tony Vigona. Apparently, Vigona doesn't qualify as He never actually played professionally at the top level - his article was initialy AFD'd, but was user deleted under CSD:H. Cooper, I'm having a hell of a time finding any refs on the guy - he only played for us twice, and according to Footywire, he only lasted a week. If we're going to get articles on these two up, I'm going to need some serious help to establish notability which will get them in. Any takers to give me a hand? Thanks! CharlieTheCabbie (talk) 21:53, 20 July 2014 (UTC)

Vigona may qualify under the third criterion of WP:NAFL for his exploits in the NTFL but it's hard to tell without having access to contemporary media reports. Hack (talk) 01:21, 21 July 2014 (UTC)

That list of indigenous footballers is also very old, may not be complete or correct, or as you've found, might not be compliant with our current notability standards. The links earlier on the ToDo page to the players - separated into multiple season and single season players is more comprehensive as to what's left to do. The redlinks on the single season list, especially of the pre 1970s players, might end up being converted into mainly redirects to the club lists - ie List of Sydney Swans players, that are also still full of redlinks. Of course if there is someone notable either for play in other leagues, other sports or other life work on those lists they can still be created, and not redirected (I did one single VFL season player the other week who's in the Stawell Gift Hall of Fame). The-Pope (talk) 07:51, 21 July 2014 (UTC)

I've pruned the Indigenous to do list. It looks like most of the remaining names are 0-gamers who may not be notable. Hack (talk) 08:07, 29 July 2014 (UTC)

2013 AFL Draft

Hi all, it's been a while since I posted here, but I've recently been doing work on the 2013 AFL Draft page, mainly in terms of tidying up the tables and article in general. I was hoping I could get some input into whether you think the structure of the article works.

For example, I am not too convinced the "Changes by team" table is needed, however I have left it in for now. My goal is to perhaps get this list up to Featured List standard, so it would be great if anyone who has had experience in that process to give a few pointers. Ultimately, I would like this article to serve as a model for the related draft pages and improve our coverage of this topic.

Thanks, Allied45 (talk) 06:11, 28 July 2014 (UTC)

I agree that the 'changes by team' table is a space-filler, particularly when there is only ten or twenty trades to sort through (plus it has a bad heading, as it refers to delisted and retiring players which aren't given in the table). I also think the excessive list at the bottom of the National Draft table, explaining the full journey of every draft pick, is superfluous. Aspirex (talk) 07:29, 28 July 2014 (UTC)

Everything you wrote was my initial thoughts as well! Thanks for the feedback, Allied45 (talk) 12:17, 28 July 2014 (UTC)

The changes look great. I agree that the changes by team section isn't needed, maybe it belongs more in the 2014 AFL season article? I really like (and was probably the author) of the tracking of the draft picks, and think that pouring them as notes is a neat solution compared to having them in the table. I think the US sports do that with their pick trades. I'm not really a fan of the coloured cells, and hate having the key before the table - I want to see the content first, if I don't understand what something means, give me a hyperlink/popup or I'll look below the table to see what everything means. The-Pope (talk) 13:37, 28 July 2014 (UTC)

Okay, so it seems that the changes section is out. Yes, I have seen the notes for draft picks on US sport lists as well, so I say we'll keep that for now at least. Using colour also seems pretty standard across most forms of lists, and I would think most people would find this helpful alongside text/symbols. I may have come up with a happy medium in regards to the key though - I've moved it to the right side of the table, so let me know what you think. Cheers, Allied45 (talk) 12:41, 29 July 2014 (UTC)

One last comment, the refs chosen are almost exclusively from afl.com.au. Many, especially those who work for other media, doubt the true independence of afl.com.au, and for avoidance of any doubt, I'd chuck in a few refs from Fairfax/News Corp/Yahoo/Ninemsn/ABC/Sportal/AAP etc just to vary it up a bit - especially as you're going to the hard work of adding archive links now, not just when they go dead in a few years time, which is a great idea, by the way. Regards, The-Pope (talk) 14:53, 29 July 2014 (UTC)

One game wonder - notability

I've come across a player called Andy Demetriou who was selected once for South Melbourne but didn't make it off the bench. Other than the cooincidence of having the same name as a slightly more successful footballer, he doesn't seem to have got a lot of coverage in reliable sources. Given he didn't really appear in an actual match, what do people think about his notability? Hack (talk) 05:54, 29 July 2014 (UTC)

Looks notable to me, see for example this write up in the Sun. Should probably be created at Andy Demetriou (footballer born 1958) though, and have Andy Demetriou redirect to the former chief. On the general topic of one game wonders, some will be notable (any chance I get, I'll give Ken Hall (footballer) a plug), but for some where virtually no coverage exists it might be better off to just create them as redirects to the relevant "List of X Football Club players" article as The-Pope suggests above. Jenks24 (talk) 06:31, 29 July 2014 (UTC)

I think he won a couple of flags with Port Melbourne, and I am fairly sure I saw an article about him (appraising him as a VFA player) in the Saturday Age some time during the early-to-mid-80s. Of players who've played only one or a couple of VFL/AFL games, I'd place Demetriou at least in the top 15-20% for notability on that basis. Aspirex (talk) 08:24, 30 July 2014 (UTC)

Retrospective Liston and Field medals

Does anyone have a reference showing that the J. J. Liston Trophy and Field Medal were awarded retrospectively to players who lost on countback? I'm pretty sure it happened, but I haven't been able to find a reliable source confirming it. Aspirex (talk) 02:39, 3 August 2014 (UTC)

First question is did they ever have countbacks? Recorder Cup (pre-1940s) didn't - http://nla.gov.au/nla.news-article12454494. If you know the name of someone who lost on countback, search for them in http://newsstore.fairfax.com.au/apps/newsSearch.ac?sy=nstore. Nothing there for Liston and countback or retrospective though. The-Pope (talk) 02:59, 3 August 2014 (UTC)

Never mind, I've stumbled quite accidentally across the reference I need. Aspirex (talk) 07:58, 24 August 2014 (UTC)

List of retrospective medallists and further info on the award can be found here: http://www.hardballget.net/liston-medallists.html Easty01 (talk) 18:08, 25 August 2014 (UTC)

External links to afltables and Footywire

I've noted on quite a few of our year based Brownlow Medal articles, that the external links to AFLTables and Footywire are used as sources for the medal listings and vote tally for each respective year. I've also noticed that our references sections are 99% empty. While I was speaking to someone in the help channel for the English Misplaced Pages on IRC, it was suggested that we can simply strip out the External Links headers, and use the two external links as reliable 3rd party references. Any thoughts on this? CharlieTheCabbie|Yack to the driver 23:53, 6 September 2014 (UTC)

Anti-AFL POV pushing at Queensland rugby league team

Can I have some more eyes at the above article please. Only two of us have played on the Talk page for this issue, so we need more input. An editor who is happy to have players simply play for different codes when they move from one form of rugby to another insists on describing them as being poached when they choose to play Australian football. I think even the editor involved agrees that "poached" is a non-neutral term, but argues that it is what actually happened (and apparently doesn't happen when they change rugby codes). I believe it would do no harm at all, and be a much better look for Misplaced Pages, if we used the neutral term "recruited", but he won't have a bar of it.

Note that this has already been taken to the NPOV Noticeboard. No real support for our AFL hating editor's position. But he persists. HiLo48 (talk) 07:49, 26 September 2014 (UTC)

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