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:::What I meant by POV was your outlandish statement that ''German massacres of Poles seem to be nominated once or twice every week''. Do you keep tabs on this? Otherwise, you are welcome to present your opinions on this article. ] (]) 03:21, 13 September 2008 (UTC)
:::What I meant by POV was your outlandish statement that ''German massacres of Poles seem to be nominated once or twice every week''. Do you keep tabs on this? Otherwise, you are welcome to present your opinions on this article. ] (]) 03:21, 13 September 2008 (UTC)
::::Only from ''yourself'', in the past month we have seen , , articles ''in the past month'' about massacres of Poles. And others submit them as well. So no, it is not POV to state that these are common, it is easily sourced. ] <sup>(]) </sup> 07:20, 14 September 2008 (UTC)
::::Only from ''yourself'', in the past month we have seen , , articles ''in the past month'' about massacres of Poles. And others submit them as well. So no, it is not POV to state that these are common, it is easily sourced. ] <sup>(]) </sup> 07:20, 14 September 2008 (UTC)
:I am sorry Sherurcji, but I do not really know what you mean. None of these articles is about massacres of Poles, so stop POV-pushing, and leave your prejudices to yourself. ] (]) 20:01, 14 September 2008 (UTC)
{{*mp}}... that the ''']''' features a red lion passant to symbolise Tasmanians' sense of loyalty to the British Empire? ] (]) 15:47, 10 September 2008 (UTC)
{{*mp}}... that the ''']''' features a red lion passant to symbolise Tasmanians' sense of loyalty to the British Empire? ] (]) 15:47, 10 September 2008 (UTC)
... that the death of child monarch Kerekorio Manu Rangi in 1867 ended the ancient dynasty of Easter Island, which according to local belief "went back to the gods themselves"?
... that a widespread violin performance scam was described by radio host Scott Simon as "one more raindrop in the storm of schemes that blur our view of what's right in front of us"?
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This page often seems to be backlogged. If the DYK template has not been updated for substantially more than 6 hours, it may be useful to attract the attention of one of the administrators who regularly updates the template. See the page Misplaced Pages:Did you know/Admins for a list of administrators who have volunteered to help with this project.
... that after writing nine unproduced spec scripts, screenwriterGustin Nash wrote his first successful screenplay, Charlie Bartlett, after his father told him "You can do it"? (self-nom) It'd be great to work in that the premise of the film was of a boy whose mantra was "You can do it" - but we might be approaching the max word count. —97198 (talk) 10:21, 14 September 2008 (UTC)
not entirely uncontroversial, I suppose, but his claims have been held true by the United Nations. The article is extensively sourced in this respect. Punkmorten (talk) 11:50, 14 September 2008 (UTC)
Commentary: Anyone who has played one game in Major League Baseball can have an article, BUT why should we feature an article on the Main Page about a guy who played in 24 games (and only 30 innings) in his entire career and only won 2? I know we want to encourage new articles, but this is stretching it. In my opinion, a baseball player should have to be truly notable in at least SOME way beyond just playing a few games in the big leagues to be featured in DYK. Cbl62 (talk) 19:48, 13 September 2008 (UTC)
Basically the same thing I was about to say... so I won't repeat it. In the other hand, the hook isn't very interesting, so I wouldn't have verified it anyway. I've seen a baseball DYK about a player who only played at one game in his entire career, which would be Larry Gowell. Though, the hook nominated was very interesting and notable (the ball he hit was accepted into the Hall of Fame since it was the last one before the DH rule), so it was accepted as a result, no matter how many games he played. It's really the hook that matters. This one isn't very interesting. Unless you can find a much more interesting hook for him, we'll accept it. Thanks, RyRy (talk) 19:56, 13 September 2008 (UTC)
I agree with RyRy that there needs to be something interesting about the hook. A player being picked up in March during spring training and then released at the end of March without making the club is simply not unusual, interesting, remarkable, or noteworthy.Cbl62 (talk) 20:03, 13 September 2008 (UTC)
... that early 20th century French photographer Robert Demachy took hundreds of photographs and wrote more than one thousand articles and books on photography, but in 1914 he suddenly gave up photography without any notice or explanation? No one has ever found out what caused him to give up his passion, and to this day the reason for the sudden change remains a mystery.Lexaxis7 (talk) 05:28, 14 September 2008 (UTC)
... that French photographer Robert Demachy took hundreds of photographs and wrote more than a thousand articles and books on photography, but suddenly gave up the subject without any explanation? (under 200 characters) Kablammo (talk) 11:25, 14 September 2008 (UTC)
Date, length, and second part of hook confirmed; source does not explictly say area is an important volcano for subglacial volcanism. Kablammo (talk) 23:23, 13 September 2008 (UTC)
Changed. I said it is an important volcano for subglacial volcanism because its subglacial volcanism appears to be studied in detail almost yearly, which is unlike any other Canadian volcano. Black Tusk (talk) 00:12, 14 September 2008 (UTC)
Does that mean ancient rulers like Julius Caesar and Alexander the Great weren't exactly European, weren't exactly kings, or didn't exactly have ancient biographies? At least the hook sounds wrong without more explanation. Art LaPella (talk) 01:46, 13 September 2008 (UTC)
I am certainly not an expert on this subject, so will answer the best I can. Perhaps the hook should be reworded to make it more clear. Changed it a couple of times already, since it didn't look good to me initially.
Wasn't Julius Caesar a ruler of the Roman Empire and Alexander the Great an ancient ruler of Macedonia - which these territories later became "European"? Didn't Charlemagne ("the father of Europe") establish the foundation for a "European civilization" distinct from that of ancient Rome and from the contemporary Byzantine and Islamic Empires? Wasn't the idea of being a united Europe start with his reign? Looking at the article on Europe it says: Charlemagne, a Frankish king of the Carolingian dynasty who had conquered most of Western Europe, was anointed "Holy Roman Emperor" by the Pope in 800. This led to the founding of the Holy Roman Empire, which eventually became centred in the German principalities of central Europe.
The reference source says: The first biography of a European king was Vita, Karoli Magni (Life of Charles the Great), a biography of Charlemagne written circa 830 by Einhard. Do you have a suggestion on a possible alternate hook? I am sure I could agree with whatever you suggest that would make it clearer. --Doug Coldwell
ALT: ... that the Vita Karoli Magni(later version pictured), a biography of Charlemagne, is the first about a medieval European king? Johnbod (talk) 19:57, 13 September 2008 (UTC) or does "first" need an object? The picture is about 400 years after the work was composed, which I think needs saying.
That is a lot better. The idea that the concept of "Europe" was essentially born with the Carolingian Empire - though certainly maintained by some historians - is far too contentious to be presented as an objective fact on DYK. Lampman (talk) 20:29, 13 September 2008 (UTC)
A well-written, new article which meets DYK requirements, assuming good faith in use of offline sources. Suggest removing "hate" from hook ("resentment" is sufficient), and stating that it was one of the causes, or led to, the war, as wars typically have multiple causes, and the war started several years after the Drifts Crisis. Kablammo (talk) 11:33, 12 September 2008 (UTC)
I changed brought down to toppled which should shave off the requisite five characters. I guess the whole "about 200 characters" has gone out the window and 200 is now a limit? --JayHenry (talk) 18:55, 14 September 2008 (UTC)
This article is new on the 12th.. article history clearly shows a move from userspace on the 12th. "17:18, 12 September 2008 Iain99 (Talk | contribs | block) m (moved User:Iain99/WAR to World altitude record (mountaineering): Ready for article space) (undo)" ... therefore suggest nom be moved to Sep 12th section. Article length and expansion verified. Hook is sourced. ++Lar: t/c04:42, 13 September 2008 (UTC)
The "even though" implies some contradiction. The second battle star was earned because the vessel was sunk as a blockship in the invasion; the ship's participation in the battle was to serve as a blockship. It might be better to simplify the hook or find another. Kablammo (talk) 23:08, 11 September 2008 (UTC)
My understanding of the sources is that the second battle star was earned because they were in combat (part of which involved shooting down a plane before the ship was sunk), not merely because the ship was sunk. Yes, they were at the Normandy beach because the ship had been pre-selected for sinking, but I don't think the hook is misleading. — Bellhalla (talk) 05:13, 12 September 2008 (UTC)
The source (The Telegraph) called it "inevitable". I guess I could find other sources as well. I wouldn't mind dropping the "considered". Do you think we should? -- Nudve (talk) 19:49, 11 September 2008 (UTC)
Based on the text-only version (), there are 1,621 characters. But that's with spaces, I'm not sure if the statistics are without. --Gwib (talk) 21:33, 13 September 2008 (UTC)
... that the 2004 miniseriesCategory 6: Day of Destruction was a ratings success for CBS, earning the highest ratings of any show during the November sweeps week, yet it was generally panned by critics? -- Article expanded sixfold and self-nom by -- ] (] · ]) 15:36, 11 September 2008 (UTC)
Would you please take another look at ths ? I worked very hard to make sure that I used on-line sources so that it qualifies for DYK, but it is anything but a straight cut and paste job. Admittedly all the information is available elsewhere but how else do you write a feature on someone who has been dead fifty years? ♦ Jongleur ♦08:04, 14 September 2008 (UTC)
Most of the copy-pasting has been fixed, however the article could still do with a good copyedit - I've personally never read a book where sentences had two full-stops (periods) at the end or where sentences didn't have a full-stop at the end. He should also be referred to as "Fyffe" as he's not everyone's best mate Will. I'm also going to tag for POV with statements like "Will Fyffe was a man of great honesty and integrity, and this comes across in his songs when heard today" (which is copy-pasted, by the way) and "A talented young actor...". Irony is subjective, too. —97198 (talk) 10:37, 14 September 2008 (UTC)
True, but there's an overwhelming keep vote there. Seems a little unfair if a tendentious afd can hold up a DYK for 5 days, bu which time it is too late. Perhaps someone could snowball the AfD as there will obviously not be a consensus to delete.--Troikoalogo (talk) 11:01, 11 September 2008 (UTC)
... that the phrase lipstick on a pig may have its origins in the eighteen century expression "A hog in armour is still but a hog"? (better hook - less controversial and political - article has stabilised now and the off-topic stuff is gone. (self nom) --Troikoalogo (talk) 15:34, 13 September 2008 (UTC)
The 60 in the BBC headline of 5 February referred to 20 each confirmed from the first two ships, plus 19 presumed dead in the Ross Cleveland ( but one was later discovered to have survived), plus one dead from another ship, the Notts County, which was also wrecked in Isafjordur on 4 February but was not a Hull ship. The final official total in the "triple trawler tragedy" itself is indeed 58 - see the new cites provided. Karenjc14:18, 11 September 2008 (UTC)
It's hard to find a single incontrovertible and authoritative source to confirm this online - the figure is correct and I have a pic of the official memorials showing all 58 names, but it's in a book and copyright unfortunately. Could always change the hook to "... that the crews of three ships all died, apart from one sole survivor, in the 1968 triple trawler tragedy? Karenjc15:17, 11 September 2008 (UTC)
Only in the sense that, as you quite rightly observed above, other sources like this do get the numbers wrong, and there's no "official" online record to make a nice, easy citation. Karenjc17:47, 11 September 2008 (UTC)
Both the event and the article are well-qualified to be featured in DYK. If you wish you could give an alternate hook such as:
The hook is not supported by a reference; the town's website referenced for other propositions only states that it "is recognized as the oldest one-room RED BRICK school in continuous operation" (emphasis in original). Kablammo (talk) 21:24, 11 September 2008 (UTC)
Ignoring the fact that "German massacres of Poles" seem to be nominated once or twice every week to be included on the front page, raising concerns about neutrality and agenda-pushing...this article has major NPOV concerns. I've fixed a few of them, but literally dozens remain. Poles "eliminate" Germans while Germans "brutally murder" Poles, &c. There's no chance this can pass NPOV concerns in its present state. Sherurcij20:46, 10 September 2008 (UTC)
Steve Dufour, please assume good faith, the person who commanded the attack is still alive and seriously I have no idea what you mean by a hoax. There are many things in the world you possibly do not believe in, yet they exist. Sherurcij, please take your time and help out with the article. If you have more sources, please add them and please keep your POV about what is/is not on front page to yourself. This raid was real, I have managed to find one source in German which confirms it. Tymek (talk) 01:13, 11 September 2008 (UTC)
I don't have more sources, I am simply trying to remove some of the rampant POVisms in language from the article; not fact-checking your sources. You can't say that Germans "brutally murdered" Poles, and then say that Poles "eliminated" Germans and such. And it would seem quite silly to nominate something for the front page, and then tell people to keep their opinions about it to themselves. Sherurcij23:59, 12 September 2008 (UTC)
What I meant by POV was your outlandish statement that German massacres of Poles seem to be nominated once or twice every week. Do you keep tabs on this? Otherwise, you are welcome to present your opinions on this article. Tymek (talk) 03:21, 13 September 2008 (UTC)
Only from yourself, in the past month we have seen one, two, three articles in the past month about massacres of Poles. And others submit them as well. So no, it is not POV to state that these are common, it is easily sourced. Sherurcij07:20, 14 September 2008 (UTC)
I am sorry Sherurcji, but I do not really know what you mean. None of these articles is about massacres of Poles, so stop POV-pushing, and leave your prejudices to yourself. Tymek (talk) 20:01, 14 September 2008 (UTC)
The article says "..it is assumed that the red lion is a link with ith England..." and that is not enough on which to base a hook. Boston (talk) 16:20, 13 September 2008 (UTC)
I disagree that we should apply that policy so strictly here, since it's primarily meant to avoid shortchanging anyone reading printed versions of pages, and DYK is a web-only aspect of Misplaced Pages. Although I agree that this link was a little too oblique, sometimes using the exact article title results in some really tortured prose. But we can discuss this on the talk page. Daniel Case (talk) 17:20, 11 September 2008 (UTC)
Someone else changed it back to my version. Maybe there is some more interesting fact in the article that could be used. The group is fairly important, especially now that religious issues are playing such a big part in the election. Steve Dufour (talk) 13:40, 12 September 2008 (UTC)
... that Sir John Stonor was one of only two Chief Justices of the Common Pleas to be appointed on three separate occasions? New article, self-nom, 1800 chars. the Reference for that is a bit difficult; I can't find anything specifically stating that, so i've simply linked the list of appointees; you can see from that that he is one of only two yadda yadda. Ironholds02:04, 10 September 2008 (UTC)
hmm you don't mean this list do you? As its not a reliable source. If you find a reliable source them add a source to the wikilist as well as that would be brilliant too. (note Xn4 knows a bit about this ...). Oh and your article seems short but I havnt counted the characters. Cheers Victuallers (talk) 11:50, 10 September 2008 (UTC)
No, I meant the Oxford DNB list; you can tell because that's the ref used in the inline citation. The article is 1800 chars, as I said. I'll add a source to the list once i've finished creating articles on everyone to hold the position since 1190; thats been kind of taking up my time.Ironholds22:24, 10 September 2008 (UTC)
... that medieval donor portraits often showed the donor of a religious image at a completely different scale (pictured) to the main figures? hook ref is note 13, plus this & another picture. self-nom by Johnbod (talk) 13:22, 10 September 2008 (UTC)
Alternate ref is fine, length and date also good. You should probably add the more accessible Independent ref to the article as well, I think the policy is to provide alternatives to refs that require log ins - Dumelow (talk) 19:25, 14 September 2008 (UTC)
The article is currently only 1250 characters (only including the article's main prose, not references or other lists); one of the requirements for DYK entries is that the article must be at least 1500 characters. If you can expand the article within the next couple of days, it could still be able to qualify. Thanks, JamieS9319:07, 11 September 2008 (UTC)
Length and date verified. Off-line sources accepted in good faith. However, I suggest the following ALT phrasing: *... that Liberian Supreme Court Chief Justice Johnnie Lewis was rescued from an angry mob after a car he was in hit and killed a pedestrian? Cbl62 (talk) 16:58, 14 September 2008 (UTC)
Date, length and reference verified. I was suprised that the all-time scoring leader for such a storied team didn't have an article already. Nice job. One question: Shouldn't it be "all-time"? Cbl62 (talk) 17:05, 14 September 2008 (UTC)
Is "and that its failure..." an expansion of "Did you know that..." or "Guru Maharaj Ji's followers predicted that..."? Maybe make that clear. —97198 (talk) 11:04, 9 September 2008 (UTC)
:nice idea but 1500 characters of text at least and at least one inline ref on the main fact. Lots of refs and much more than 1500 characters are better. Don't give up! Victuallers (talk) 18:38, 14 September 2008 (UTC)
Sorry: Wasn't familiar w/ "Instructions" when posted this (just strike it out, if wish to); I created the article on August 28, 2008 and expanded it over the past weeks to about twice its initial length; it started at 8,008 or so chars. and is now (9/09, EST) about 30,170); under 4-fold (not 5-fold). Doesn't meet parameters of instructions. --NYScholar (talk) 04:01, 10 September 2008 (UTC)
Length, date and hook verified. Moved from the September 8 section. This was created on the 9th, not the 8th. -- RyRy (talk) 06:31, 12 September 2008 (UTC)
There are several issues here. The screenshot can not be used as self-made, it has to be labelled as fair use, and can't be on the main page - unless the uploader is also the creator of the game, in which case there are WP:COI issues. The article is written too much like an advert; particularly glaring is the consistent use of the second person. Also, User:MikelZap puts this up as a self-nom, but according to the edit history he has only contributed a minor part of the article. This is not in itself a problem, but if there are indeed WP:COI issues, then this becomes relevant. Lampman (talk) 19:54, 13 September 2008 (UTC)
Changed "film writer" to "screenwriter" as "screen" applies to both film and television, and as far as I can tell the writer above has only written for television, not film. —97198 (talk) 08:19, 9 September 2008 (UTC)
Begs the question what are "Chester races". Article refers to "Chester Races", and links to Chester Cup about horse races. Hook could be reworded to clarify. Also how about "injuring many" rather than awkward "30-40"? doncram (talk) 06:10, 9 September 2008 (UTC) fixed "chester races" ... = Chester Racecourse ok Victuallers (talk) 15:37, 9 September 2008 (UTC)
This is saveable, but it need some minor? work. The only ref is "spanish wikipedia" and then has no link to the spanish article. Add it. I would also try and add some links to English sites too and make sure one is inline. Victuallers (talk) 14:31, 9 September 2008 (UTC)
Link to es.wp added (was an oversight). Added inline ref. Looking for more (than the referenced books), but hard to come by online as he was not a major national character. -- Alexf17:41, 9 September 2008 (UTC)
You are correct. I had not noticed it was indeed a wiki-mirror site. Ref was removed from article. Will look for more. thx. -- Alexf13:08, 10 September 2008 (UTC)
.jpg)
Desert paintbrush
Prose is only 1285 characters. —97198 (talk) 06:49, 14 September 2008 (UTC)
Dates, lengths are good; print reference accepted on good faith. Kablammo (talk) 11:15, 14 September 2008 (UTC)
Length, date and reference verified.Cbl62 (talk) 19:37, 13 September 2008 (UTC)
Date, length, and second part of hook confirmed; source does not explictly say area is an important volcano for subglacial volcanism. Kablammo (talk) 23:23, 13 September 2008 (UTC)
Sorry, still 226 characters by my count.--LAAFan review 15:06, 13 September 2008 (UTC)
- amended last hook and checked it out. tick Victuallers (talk) 10:37, 12 September 2008 (UTC)
:nice idea but 1500 characters of text at least and at least one inline ref on the main fact. Lots of refs and much more than 1500 characters are better. Don't give up! Victuallers (talk) 18:38, 14 September 2008 (UTC)
- needs spanish and access to offline source. suspect online is a wiki-mirror site Victuallers (talk) 12:11, 10 September 2008 (UTC)