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Hi Wiki team ,

I would like to put lot of editions in AsaRam Bapu ji Wiki Page.

It's dissapointing to see that wiki team does not have a valid information on him , Inspite he being one of the most spiritual & divine soul on this Earth.

He has been doing endless contributions to save human & Mankind, for the upliftment of women in India , to teach the younsters the path of divine spirituality & many more.

He started doing the Satsang & Sewa at the age of only 23 after attaining the Brahmagyan from his Guru ji Sai Lilashah . It's been more than 50 years now he is spreading the divine knowledge of true Self.

Not thousand & not lakhs , Millions of people have been benifitted by his holiness & kindness.

I would request you to please remove / atleast unhighlight the controversies that were definetely imposed on him by the Jealous people of world.

Rather please put the contributions & thousand of miracles he has done for the upliftment and the ease of Mankind . You would definetely be blessed .

Please refer the Ashram site http://www.ashram.org/PujyaBapuji/AboutBapuji.aspx . You can find 3 hours documentary as well here .

There is recent You tube video where with Mantra Science ,https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hJj4Z6NfT_k&feature=youtube_gdata_player

A Drought effected area where there had been no water since 4 years , with his power & blessings , it Rained there for 4 days . It saved the life of many farmers , children & gave boost to local plantation as well.

There have been endless examples of such miracles.

Thank you Regards Kanika — Preceding unsigned comment added by Kaarora (talk • contribs) 07:07, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

Recent controversies

Reduction

The article was originally written with a lot of unreferenced biographical information. There were lots of claims presented as facts. I've gone ahead and reduced the article to a stub. In my opinion, new material should be clearly referenced, with no unverifiable claims and neutral in tone.TheRingess (talk) 20:47, 24 March 2010 (UTC)

proposed merge

Sant Shri Asaramji Bapu is a recently created article that I think should be merged into here.

SPat 13:37, 27 March 2010 (UTC)

I agree.. --Rohit (talk) 13:51, 27 March 2010 (UTC)

Rohit, your edit was in violation of Misplaced Pages:Verifiability. --Nosedown (talk) 21:18, 27 March 2010 (UTC)

This apge should replace the page that is currently shown on wikipedia. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 59.164.229.5 (talk) 06:10, 28 March 2010 (UTC)

Unsourced Information

All information in this article must adhere to the policy on articles about living persons. I would strongly encourage anyone who wants to improve this article to cite sources in support of any information added. I've reverted the changes by User:Fragin2010 as they simply re-introduced unreferenced information into the article. Please discuss here before re-adding the information. —Joshua Scott (LiberalFascist) 01:30, 22 April 2010 (UTC)

Unnecessary Information in Foundation Section

Following information seems unnecessary and should be deleted/rewritten!

Live webcast of Spiritual Discourse is facilitated for more than 5 crore followers (sadhaks) living worldwide through the Ashram website. The more information about ashram is available at here:- More Info About Ashram - Ashram.org

Refer notes are not from trusted resources. Here direct link is provided and also unclaimed 5 Crore followers are listed! Please provide necessary reference and rewrite it as per wiki standards Deepeshdeomurari (talk) 14:00, 12 November 2012 (UTC)

self-proclaimed...?

i would request mr/ms author to pls go thru' the dictionary to find out meaning of the term "self-proclaimed", he has over 5 crore followers, for whom he is the spiritual guru. so pls remove this word(from introduction column). — Preceding unsigned comment added by 61.246.197.51 (talk) 10:34, 8 January 2013 (UTC) And also if you can write about comments in the gang rape case, you can also write about the ashrams and bal sanskar kendras.Ankush98 (talk) 05:19, 11 January 2013 (UTC)

Edit request on 20 January 2013

This edit request has been answered. Set the |answered= or |ans= parameter to no to reactivate your request.

Dear Sir,

Request you to allow me to edit this page as i will want to add the biography and foundations in this page, which was available in previous versions done by user naveentirthani. The current page does not show the biography and foundations in it. For some season someone has cut short and only given controversies in the article. Since i am a well wisher of Asaram Bapu and could like to add and highlight various things related to Asaram Bapu.

Please give me the required permission to edit this page.

Thanks & Regards Anand Anandraheja (talk) 03:25, 20 January 2013 (UTC)

You can edit this and other semiprotected pages when your account becomes autoconfirmed. That normally happens after your account is at least 4 days old with at least 10 edits. RudolfRed (talk) 03:31, 20 January 2013 (UTC)

Current issues in the article

• Neutrality of the article is completely disputed.
• There are many WP:SPS and non reliable sources.
• There are too many formatting errors and external links in article body!

Please discuss first before adding these content! --Tito Dutta (talk) 18:02, 21 January 2013 (UTC)

Naveentirthani/IPs, please don't keep adding the same content again and again! Discuss here first! --Tito Dutta (talk) 03:47, 22 January 2013 (UTC)

Titodutta - please let me know , why cant we keep old revisions data which prevailed for long time. Same content was already in in older revisions, I am just restoring those.Naveentirthani (talk)

Yes, you are badly copy pasting! Please read WP:COPYWITHIN. And it was in old version- it does not mean sense, the portion is completely unencyclopedic and many isues. Please don't add those content before finishing the discussion here! --Tito Dutta (talk) 05:03, 22 January 2013 (UTC)

Comments by Ankush98

The article is not neutral at all! The controversies have been highlighted too much! Ankush98 (talk) 04:25, 22 January 2013 (UTC)

This was for those edits by another editor. And about your edits, both the citations are wrongly formatted (though I must agree both citations are reliable).. and "Asaram Bapu escaped miraculously by the grace of god.." etc this is not encyclopaedic tone. --Tito Dutta (talk) 04:37, 22 January 2013 (UTC)

I made an attempt at rephrasing it. The incident seems barely noteworthy, and the sources seem acceptable. We must follow the policy of using a neutral point of view, so I agree that saying it was a miracle is not appropriate in this case. If sources, (reliable sources I must add) describe is as a miracle, we can say that it was describes as a miracle, but we can't say that ourselves.Grayfell (talk) 05:37, 22 January 2013 (UTC)

Do we need an h2 paragraph to describe this incidence? --Tito Dutta (talk) 05:52, 22 January 2013 (UTC)

Good point, probably not.Grayfell (talk) 06:22, 22 January 2013 (UTC)

Extraordinary claims require stronger souring; claims of miracles require the strongest sourcing of all. bobrayner (talk) 11:36, 23 January 2013 (UTC)

"objectionable positions with women"

I have reverted this edit because Source6 mentions this! --Tito Dutta (talk) 06:29, 25 January 2013 (UTC)

Ankush98, you need to come here and explain yourself. Why have you now twice (at least) removed that line with the claim that it wasn't covered in the source, when very obviously it was? (The relevant bit in the source is right there next to the one that supports the preceding clause in our article, and which you left untouched, so you will have a hard time explaining to us why you didn't see it.) Fut.Perf. ☼ 07:55, 25 January 2013 (UTC)

The line was mentioned in only one source.And it was written by an editor, who could be biased in his opinions .So I request you to remove the line.It is very easy to malign a person.Ankush98 (talk) 08:01, 25 January 2013 (UTC)

That is not what you were saying earlier. You didn't say the line was unreliable (that might have been worth discussing); you said it wasn't there. Twice. That was not true. You must have known it was not true. Why did you state things that weren't true? Fut.Perf. ☼ 08:22, 25 January 2013 (UTC)

And please don't edit other editors' posts! --Tito Dutta (talk) 08:06, 25 January 2013 (UTC) word added, shown in green --Tito Dutta (talk) 08:25, 25 January 2013 (UTC)

What is meant by "don't other editors' posts"?Ankush98 (talk) 08:14, 25 January 2013 (UTC)

• This– you deleted comments of other editors and this (you changed the subject line without asking or informing me) --Tito Dutta (talk) 08:22, 25 January 2013 (UTC)

Titodutta: I notice you added this source as an additional reference to the passage in question. I'd be a bit reluctant about that one: it was published only on 9 January, well after the claim was in our article here, and the whole piece on OneIndiaNews looks suspiciously like a paraphrase of our Misplaced Pages article. Could be a case of "citogenesis" . Fut.Perf. ☼ 09:55, 25 January 2013 (UTC)

Might be! After subject's comment on 2012 Delhi gang rape case both he and his comment have been discussed in many newspapers/sites. Oneindia.in is generally considered as an RS. But, the point you have mentioned surely has some weight. I found another, but felt OneIndia was better! --Tito Dutta (talk) 10:30, 25 January 2013 (UTC)

No i am sorry I had opened another link and did not find the given line in it.But please hear my point.Ankush98 (talk) 03:18, 26 January 2013 (UTC)

Edit request on 26 January 2013

{{edit semi-protected|answered=yes}

Please change the text in Biography Section to the one given below

Overlong article copy snipped. – Fut.Perf. ☼ 11:39, 26 January 2013 (UTC)

Deep345 (talk) 04:15, 26 January 2013 (UTC)

• Involved editor's comment Heading fmt changed, please change heading from h3 to h2 and h4 to h2 if someone adds it in the article. Also, this edit has been reported in SPI. --Tito Dutta (talk) 05:23, 26 January 2013 (UTC)
  • Not done. Overlong request, didn't make it clear what the changes to the current version would have been, but those parts where I could spot differences on a brief scan were obviously tendentious. Deep345, please review our principles of WP:NPOV and stop the tendentious editing. Fut.Perf. ☼ 11:39, 26 January 2013 (UTC)

Migration from Sindh in Pakistan to Ahmedabad in India

Currently He is in India, and reference when he came to India is at page 2 ] if this is not valid - From where we would get this reference then? --Naveentirthani (talk) 02:57, 1 February 2013 (UTC)

Self Realization

On 2nd Day of Ashwin month in Samvat 2021 at 2:30 PM in the afternoon by the blessings of Swami Sri Lilashahji Maharaj He attained Self Realization on October 7, 1964, Asumal was transformed into Asaram Bapu . After this Asaram Bapu went into samadhi for next two and a half days. ].

What other references can be given here? -- Naveentirthani (talk) 03:09, 1 February 2013 (UTC)

That book is published by Asaram Bapu's Ashram, is it not? That is not a reliable, secondary source. If you can't find a much better source, then I don't think this belongs in the article. In addition, although not an outright disqualifier, WP:NONENG also applies here.Grayfell (talk) 03:29, 1 February 2013 (UTC)

] will this do - as a secondary source. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Naveentirthani (talk • contribs) 03:39, 1 February 2013 (UTC)

No, that is a blog. The author is anonymous, but I couldn't find any information about the site -who is hosting it, or what their policies are. There is no way to know who wrote this. There is no way to know if any fact-checking was done at all.Grayfell (talk) 04:05, 1 February 2013 (UTC)

• This user is seriously annoying! Yesterday he asked me all these questions in details and again today he has started edit warring today! He is asking the same questions again and again and/or to every editor individually. Either he is not understanding anything or he's playing a game. --Tito Dutta (talk) 06:35, 1 February 2013 (UTC)

Statements on 2012 Delhi gang rape victim

Some of the information on first paragraph has been repeated in the second one. I request the contributors to merge the two...Koteshwor (talk) 20:09, 21 February 2013 (UTC)

Dear Admins - dont you have any answer on this? You are removing all required things,and keeping only controversies, this is not at all fair. - this page should have biography section but you people have filled this up by your controversies. please answer.   — Preceding unsigned comment added by Naveentirthani (talk • contribs) 19:50, 5 April 2013 (UTC)

Remove this Page

First of all who is the real administrator or editor of this page?!! If you are unable to put-up whole biography of a saint properly.. kindly remove this page from so called prestigious Misplaced Pages. You are Just highlighting controversies which in fact are dubious one. Pandeyadityasn (talk) 13:49, 4 March 2013 (UTC)pandeyadityasn 4/03/13 7.20pm — Preceding unsigned comment added by Pandeyadityasn (talk • contribs) 13:46, 4 March 2013 (UTC)

If you have a problem with it, please take it to WP:AFD. Mdann52 (talk) 13:52, 4 March 2013 (UTC)

Diksha, and Crowd

I had given 2 links on diksha and crowd which usually gather at his Satsangs. How many links you want for this. what language should i use, If my language is wrong then correct it and keep it, why are you removing it entirely. Here the references http://articles.timesofindia.indiatimes.com/2005-05-08/patna/27833997_1_asaram-bapu-diksha-disciples http://articles.timesofindia.indiatimes.com/2001-12-02/ahmedabad/27250212_1_asaram-bapu-students-throng-sant http://www.bhaskar.com/article/MP-OTH-58684-3955012.html http://www.bhaskar.com/article/RAJ-OTH-1447153-3466899.html?PRVNX= Naveentirthani (talk) 19:58, 5 April 2013 (UTC)

• These articles mention about single events. A West Bengal woman politician's public speeches gather huge crowds, but her 2-3 speeches in some villages were not attended by so many people, it was reported in newspaper. So, from one or two events it can't be concluded that Asaram Bapu's Diksha festivals are always populous. It can be written like- "In MONTH, YEAR, the diksha festival at PLACE was attended by N people" or there should be some clear mention in reliable sources that his diksha festivals are generally crowded. Also, don't push PoV using phrases like " His extraordinary spirituality" or capital "H" in "his"! --Tito Dutta (contact) 20:07, 5 April 2013 (UTC)
  • His Satsangs are ever crowded, I have already given you 4 links, how many more links you want. His Satsang Schedule is also given at www.ashram.org - You yourself can check - normally in a year around Satsangs are held are yearly around 150-200 places or even more than that. If I am pushing PoV phrases, then you can also correct it, but you should not remove it entirely. To watch how many devotees come to His Satsang please visit official youtube channel - http://www.youtube.com/channel/UCMamNBjyzIR-824ZjntAXmg -- Naveentirthani (talk) 20:14, 5 April 2013 (UTC)

• Re-read the comment above! Both the ToI articles are covering single event. You have told His Satsangs are ever crowded - which source mentions it? You can use their website as source! And writing style was an issue too!--Tito Dutta (contact) 20:26, 5 April 2013 (UTC)

• Revisit the links, 1 TOI link is a news of Ahmedabad, another is of Patna. and other 2 are of Bhaskar. And I have already said, if there was issue in my style , then correct it, why are you removing, please give answer. - simply saying your style has issue - is not the answer why you entirely removed it. Naveentirthani (talk) 20:29, 5 April 2013 (UTC)

• "Single event" does not mean "only event", that means, they are not writing on all events, but a particular event (two newspaper may have two events). Back to the points mentioned above. I previously noted too, you keep on irritating asking the same question again and again and sometimes (in the last discussion) to multiple users. Either you are deliberately trying to puzzle the discussion (if so, be aware, you'll go nowhere) or you are failing to get the points (in that case, you can try WP:Adopt etc to find a mentor to gain WikiExperience). Actually it was written in the edit summary too, in clear words 1) incorrectly interpreting information 2) PoV pushing --Tito Dutta (contact) 20:42, 5 April 2013 (UTC)
• (edit conflict) None of the the sources cited support sentence "... a large crowd is gathered due to His extraordinary spirituality". This edit is original research and words like "extraordinary" are peacock terms. Correct Knowledge 20:44, 5 April 2013 (UTC)

So lets ask my sentence here only -- can i write - "His spiritual discourses are scheduled in many cities and devotees also take diksha from him in those satsang programs." what more sources and content in that is required to cite this. Please help. Yes I am novice not an expert to edit wiki pages, please help.Naveentirthani (talk) 20:51, 5 April 2013 (UTC)

• Sounds better! Minor changes:

His spiritual discourses have been scheduled in different Indian cities like Ahmedabad, Patna and devotees also took diksha from him in these satsang programs.

If any other newspaper mentions any oher city's event, that can be added after cities like. --Tito Dutta (contact) 20:59, 5 April 2013 (UTC)

• (edit conflict) again!! That seems reasonable provided you explain or wikilink satsang and diksha. You can also mention that 20,000 students visited his satsang in Ahmedabad because it is supported by one of your references. However, concluding that all his satsangs are ever crowded etc. is inappropriate. Correct Knowledge 21:01, 5 April 2013 (UTC)

Thanks a lot, I have added these now.Naveentirthani (talk) 21:14, 5 April 2013 (UTC)

• Don't add text after cite web/news as here, citation template's "title" parameter does the work. There is EngVar issues in the article. Is it following EngBritish? --Tito Dutta (contact) 21:17, 5 April 2013 (UTC)

• Again you have added a non RS which tells almost nothing! --Tito Dutta (contact) 21:34, 5 April 2013 (UTC)

will try to correct it soon . thanks for pointing. Naveentirthani (talk) 21:44, 5 April 2013 (UTC)

Edit of wikipedia policy

the line I have removed has only one source. It is the policy of wikipedia that things are added only after proper verification. when ashram.org can not be considered as a source,why can these sold media websites be considered as a source.Moreover only you told me that the language of the media cannot be directly used.Now can anyone answer me?? Kanuraj123 (talk) 06:30, 15 April 2013 (UTC)

I see no problem with the sourcing. The line is supported by a WP:SECONDARY news source. This article is simple saying that it has been reported by a valid source. The sentence is short and is not a direct paraphrase, so it is not a copyright issue if that's what you mean. The incident is very well documented in many news sources. As for Ashram.org, it is a WP:PRIMARY source. It can be used, but only with extreme caution in limited circumstances. Grayfell (talk) 07:19, 15 April 2013 (UTC)

Why is everything about asaram bapu unencyclopedic and all controversies encyclopedic material?? Kanuraj123 (talk) 04:11, 2 May 2013 (UTC)

If you can find reliable sources they can be added. If you would like to add a brief overview, written in neutral language, of his views and teachings, that can be added. Your addition was not neutral, and the source was just a mirror of an article on Ashram.org. Find a source that describes what he teaches from a neutral point of view. I agree, the article needs more information about this, but without sources, it doesn't belong here. Grayfell (talk) 04:24, 2 May 2013 (UTC)

Stop edit warring! The ToI article uses ashram.org as source, so it is not independent news! In addition, the article has no context and the info is being forced suddenly in a promotional tone! Another important point, this edit had too many formatting errors! --Tito Dutta (contact) 06:00, 2 May 2013 (UTC)

What is promotional in it?And if times of india uses it,the article must be true.what problem do you have from it?why do you want only controversies on the page? Are you not an Indian?Do we not respect Shri Asaram Bapuji?Kanuraj123 (talk) 05:04, 3 May 2013 (UTC)

I remind you to be civil, and confine your discussion to edits, not editors. Your edit misrepresents a single opinion piece republished without further commentary as being a factual account of Asaram Bapu's behavior. One single opinion piece doesn't indicate what he "often invokes" and as a piece written by him it fails to establish that this perspective is at all notable or significant. Including this statement is giving undue weight to one single article, and that is indeed promotional. If you can't find WP:SECONDARY sources, which means sources not written by Asaram Bapu or as press-releases from Ashram.org, then you almost certainly shouldn't be including it in this article. Grayfell (talk) 05:42, 3 May 2013 (UTC)

"One single opinion piece doesn't indicate what he "often invokes" and as a piece written by him",this is what you say. I also say the same thing about source 6,and so I remove It again and again.Kanuraj123 (talk) 06:54, 6 May 2013 (UTC)

Have you read WP:SECONDARY? If you actually intend to contribute to this article in a meaningful way then familiarize yourself with Misplaced Pages's policies. Once again: A source stating in neutral language what someone else has said is fine. An essay by the subject of an article is primary, which is much less desirable as a source. It also says nothing at all about what he often invokes. All it indicates is that he has talked about it once. That doesn't establish anything about his positions, or his general opinions, or his over-all teachings. If you can write a statement in a neutral point of view about his teachings with sources that support the statement, I would be very pleased to see it incorporated into this article. Grayfell (talk) 07:15, 6 May 2013 (UTC)

The source says what was mentioned by raju chandak.He could even tell a lie!Why are you not understanding this?Please let me remove this,It will not do wikipedia any harm. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 117.199.163.245 (talk) 06:40, 7 May 2013 (UTC)

This article is not saying Raju Chandak is telling the truth. It is not saying he's lying. The page is saying that he gave an affidavit to the police. That's all it's saying. Finding better sources would be a great help in improving the page. Grayfell (talk) 06:56, 7 May 2013 (UTC)

I have found a video www.youtube.com/watch?v=6UD8Pvf057U — Preceding unsigned comment added by Kanuraj123 (talk • contribs) 04:11, 8 May 2013 (UTC)

I have reverted it. The video is copyright violation. And seeing their channel it is clear they are advertising/promoting. --Tito Dutta (contact) 05:08, 8 May 2013 (UTC)

Titodutta,Even I would have done the same if I was in your situation.You are an employee of wikipedia(If my thinking is right),and try to prevent any damage to it.But please understand the fact that I am not disrupting anything.Misplaced Pages always speaks the truth.I hope you now understand that no saint has ever been so unfairly maligned as asaram bapuji.This is because he has stopped the activities of christian missionaries,who have converted almost all north east india to christianity.They wanted to erase his popularity.Even you know that North East is predominantly christian.If you want proofs,I can show You.Therefore I request you to please let me remove that unfair line.You don't need to reply on the talk page,since you must be very busy. And by the way,where in India do you live?We are (were)fighting it out in wikipedia,but havent even exchanged our phone numbers!:) My number is phone number hidden by User:Titodutta. -- — Preceding unsigned comment added by Kanuraj123 (talk • contribs) 10:10, 8 May 2013 (UTC) UTC.

You need to seriously concentrate on basic formatting. Add a space after ending a sentence. Write proper names in capital letters (eg. "Asaram Bapu" and not asaram bapu). Write words correctly (eg. not "havent" write either "have not" or "haven't") I don't mind mistakes in talk page, but, you are making similar mistakes in the article too! --Tito Dutta (contact) 10:31, 8 May 2013 (UTC)

Please tell me how to add good articles!117.220.85.151 (talk) 06:17, 9 May 2013 (UTC)

Edit request on 16 May 2013

This edit request has been answered. Set the |answered= or |ans= parameter to no to reactivate your request.

Controversies there are people who are agent of church are blaming him because he is true fighter of hindu dharma Santseva (talk)

Those information are supported by reliable sources. We have discussed on this topic already. See the other sections of this page. Attempts have been taken to expand the article (specially his "Religious activities" section), but, we lack WP:SECONDARY WP:RS. --Tito Dutta (contact) 22:10, 16 May 2013 (UTC)

Feedback

As a neutral reader, I see Misplaced Pages is no longer a reliable source. Period. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 117.192.141.157 (talk) 19:23, 15 June 2013 (UTC)

Need lot of Valid edits on this Page

I would like to put lot of editions in AsaRam Bapu ji Wiki Page.

It's dissapointing to see that wiki team does not have a valid information on him , Inspite he being one of the most spiritual & divine soul on this Earth.

He has been doing endless contributions to save human & Mankind, for the upliftment of women in India , to teach the younsters the path of divine spirituality & many more.

He started doing the Satsang & Sewa at the age of only 23 after attaining the Brahmagyan from his Guru ji Sai Lilashah . It's been more than 50 years now he is spreading the divine knowledge of true Self.

Not thousand & not lakhs , Millions of people have been benifitted by his holiness & kindness.

I would request you to please remove / atleast unhighlight the controversies that were definetely imposed on him by the Jealous people of world.

Rather please put the contributions & thousand of miracles he has done for the upliftment and the ease of Mankind . You would definetely be blessed .

Please refer the Ashram site http://www.ashram.org/PujyaBapuji/AboutBapuji.aspx . You can find 3 hours documentary as well here .

There is recent You tube video where with Mantra Science ,https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hJj4Z6NfT_k&feature=youtube_gdata_player

A Drought effected area where there had been no water since 4 years , with his power & blessings , it Rained there for 4 days . It saved the life of many farmers , children & gave boost to local plantation as well.

There have been endless examples of such miracles. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Kaarora (talk • contribs) 07:12, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

Thank you for editing, but those sources do not meet Misplaced Pages's guidelines for reliable sources. If you would like to know more about that, the article on sources is here: Misplaced Pages:Reliable sources. You may also find the discussions that have already been had at this page useful. Grayfell (talk) 07:22, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

Edit request on 16 August 2013

This edit request has been answered. Set the |answered= or |ans= parameter to no to reactivate your request.

why the good things have been removed about pujya bapuji from here. there are lot of human being got benifited from pujya bapuji. what about that . i think wiki also got a big amount to remove good things about bapuji. 111.93.130.33 (talk) 17:43, 16 August 2013 (UTC)

Improper edit request; follow the instructions or don't use the template.--Bbb23 (talk) 18:16, 16 August 2013 (UTC)

Recent Accusations of Raping a Female Minor.

Asaram Bapu has been surrounded by a lot of controversies in the past, and this one just adds to that long list. Or maybe not. Maybe this is not just a controversy or accusation. After misusing his power of being a religious Leader and 'inspiration' for many in the country that is struggling to overcome from its recent issues of increased rape cases with minors, here we have Shri Asaram Bapu being charged with rape to a young girl of 16.

Monica2207 (talk) 18:50, 21 August 2013 (UTC)Monica.

Removed sections

I just removed three sections: Attempted murder, Deaths of students, and Charged with sexual assault. The first and third sections were removed per WP:BLPCRIME. Unless there is evidence of convictions, they do not belong in this article. The second section is WP:COATRACK to the extent it obliquely accuses Asaram Bapu of being involved in the deaths. It doesn't even mention him in the section. That cannot remain, either. Please be aware that this is a WP:BLP, and once I have removed such contentious material, it cannot be restored absent a clear consensus that BLP is not violated. See WP:BLPREMOVE.--Bbb23 (talk) 00:38, 23 August 2013 (UTC)

• I am writing a reply. Please wait for few minutes. Tito☸Dutta 06:35, 23 August 2013 (UTC)
• Now—

1. I edited this article just 12 hours ago, and today morning when I saw the article I failed to recognize the article (see diff). Bbb23 removed two sections (diff), someone re added those in a worse way (diff). This article is so controversial that removal or addition without discussion will not take anywhere.
2. By writing this, I am not supporting those editors, who are trying to push PoV in the article or blanking the "controversy" section.So far, seeing my editing trend (specially the reverts, reports and talk page comments), one may feel, I have been an anti-Asaram Bapu editor. But, in fact, I am neither supporting nor opposing him or his organization. I am just trying to follow Misplaced Pages rules and policies. But, seeing this version where the article starts "Asaram Bapu is a highly controversial..." etc, I have started feeling, in Misplaced Pages, knowingly or unknowingly, the article is defaming Asaram Bapu and trying to pull him down. I am not an expert of this subject (Asaram Bapu is not very popular in Kolkata, where I live), but few Google search shows Asaram Bapu and his organization's activities, Satsang, social works, initiatives etc. Even if we apply common sense, we'll understand the person has obviously done/doing something for which he is still considered as a saint even after so many accusations. But, we mention nothing about these (his social works, activities etc) and just write scandals and controversies with every possible details. This might be an unintended attempt to defame the person (few people have already reported, see this for example).
3. If we observe the media reports on Asaram Bapu, they are divided into two parts— one part is directly against Bapu, and the other part is trying to defend Bapu. The second group of media have reported about political conspiracies etc. There are few political reasons too following India's current political condition, you need to know about UPA, NDA etc, but, I don't want to go into details. BUT, I won't be surprised if it is found that this article is being controlled by first group of editors (i.e. who are strictly against Asaram Bapu and trying to defame him). Tito☸Dutta 07:11, 23 August 2013 (UTC)

Whoa, this is the first time I'm seeing an article on a Indian spiritual leader having just one small section on him and the remaining 75% going to criticism, it's usually the other way round. In either case, I feel the sub-topics of the criticism section can be reduced and reworded as they seem very biased. I'm surprised that there has been no one interested in contributing to the rest of the article about him, his legacy and teachings etc so far, I'm sure the users who kept removing the criticism section would be interested. -Ugog Nizdast (talk) 19:04, 23 August 2013 (UTC)

• I have locked the article for five days and have restored the version without the three sections per WP:BLP. Because of my involvement, albeit minimal, I will take this to WP:AN for other administrators to review.--Bbb23 (talk) 22:08, 23 August 2013 (UTC)

1. http://www.indianexpress.com/news/asaram-bapu-shocks-holds-girl-responsible-for-delhi-gangrape-demands-rapists-be-spared/1055639/
2. Param Pujya Sant Shri Asaram Ji Bapu. Jeevan Jhaanki, Param Pujya Sant Shri Asaram Ji Bapu. Sant Shri Asaram Ji Ashram. p. 2. GGKEY:JHE2URQS83S. Retrieved 1 February 2013.
3. http://in.reuters.com/article/2013/01/09/india-delhi-gang-rape-asaram-bapu-views-idINDEE90809L20130109

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