Misplaced Pages

Image:Emily Sander.jpg (edit | ] | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (restore|cache|AfD)

This image was speedily deleted with the following summary: "WP:BLP concerns, not fair use appropriate". This deletion is unjustified, as WP:BLP does not apply to deceased subjects, and no specific WP:BLP concerns were articulated in any event. WP:NOT#CENSORED. Eso si que es 19:27, 2 December 2007 (UTC)

How do we justify fair use for this picture? Theresa Knott | The otter sank 19:34, 2 December 2007 (UTC)

To restate the fair use rationale that I provided in the deleted image:

This image constitutes fair use in Emily Sander as it

(1) Is necessary to illustrate Emily Sander's participation in the adult entertainment industry.

(2) Cannot be replaced with freely licensed content, as the subject is deceased.

(3) Will not reduce the commercial value of the image, as the image was posted publicly for promotional purposes, and since Emily Sander's adult content is not being marketed commercially at this time.

Eso si que es 19:36, 2 December 2007 (UTC)

Why can't we add a reference to the site that the picture appeared in in order to illustrate her participation in porn? We do we need to have the actual photograoh on Misplaced Pages? Theresa Knott | The otter sank 19:38, 2 December 2007 (UTC)

Accepting that argument, we wouldn't need to have any fair use images that appeared on public websites, as we could simply reference the websites in which the images appeared. Our fair use policies may be strict, but they aren't that strict. Clearly, having some fair use images from websites adds value for readers. Eso si que es 19:42, 2 December 2007 (UTC)

Comment from deleting admin: I deleted this image, which was a pornographic image of Emily Sander, a female college student who was murdered within recent weeks. The Emily Sander article already contains an image of its subject, and I do not believe a pornographic image adds to a reader's understanding, failing a fair use requirement. Additionally, I deleted the image per WP:BLP concerns. Sander may be dead, but I do not believe it is appropriate to sensationalize her biography simply because she is dead (note the article is nominated for deletion). I'm not one to cite WP:IAR, but deleting a pornographic image of a recently deceased female college student seems fitting. If the discussion concludes the deletion should be reversed, so be it, but I do not intend to restore the image myself. - auburnpilot talk 19:40, 2 December 2007 (UTC)

Why is "deleting a pornographic image of a recently deceased female college student... fitting"? Our articles often describe the accomplishments of deceased subjects. The explanation for the deletion of this image, as I understand it, seems to be predicated upon the notion that visual erotica is bad, and, as a result, that activities in the adult entertainment industry are not to be understood as achievements, but rather as failings and sources of scandal. Since Misplaced Pages is to be written from a neutral point of view, however, we cannot justify the deletion of images based on the assumption that erotica is bad. Eso si que es 19:50, 2 December 2007 (UTC)

She appears to have felt that it was bad. Our article states:

"Sander apparently kept her career mostly to herself, and only close friends knew about what she did for a living. They claim that when informed about her modeling, her boyfriend broke up with her."

So it would appear that for here, it already was the source of scandal. Theresa Knott | The otter sank 20:05, 2 December 2007 (UTC)

Actually, the Emily Sander article expressly states, in relavent part, that "According to her close friend Nikki Watson, Sander enjoyed the work and needed the money." That " Sander apparently kept her career mostly to herself" does not imply that she regarded it as shameful. Eso si que es 20:11, 2 December 2007 (UTC)

Really? I think it probably does. Anyway, we now need to think of her living relatives. BLP states "do no harm" . Theresa Knott | The otter sank 20:15, 2 December 2007 (UTC)

So, if I don't go around telling everyone my Social Security number, does that mean that I regard my Social Security number as shameful? Of course not. Non-disclosure doesn't imply shame. Furthermore, if we were to delete all content from Misplaced Pages articles that might offend living relatives of the articles' subjects, this is what we would have left to read. Eso si que es 20:23, 2 December 2007 (UTC)

Equating a Social Security number and participation in the porn industry is nonsensical. —Kurykh 22:06, 2 December 2007 (UTC)

• Endorse deletion. No compelling rationale has been offered for fair use, nor any reason why the article is benefitted by inclusion of this picture. That Misplaced Pages is not censored does not mean that we can't practice editorial discretion. Chick Bowen 20:39, 2 December 2007 (UTC)
• Endorse deletion, WP:BLP does apply to recently deceased subjects, which this one is. WP:NOT#CENSORED does not apply, and there is no valid fair use rationale. --Coredesat 21:54, 2 December 2007 (UTC)
  • I just thought of this - is there a possibility the subject was 17 when the image was taken? I am not a lawyer, but there could be 2257 issues at hand here, as well, and if she was 17, the image is technically child pornography (which should not be restored). --Coredesat 00:11, 3 December 2007 (UTC)
    • A significant problem is that this image was taken not from Sander's website, which of course is shut down, but from a third-party site. Thus nothing about it can be verified, not its authorship and copyright status, not (as you say) the age of the model when it was taken, not (as Theresa says) the subject's intentions about this photo or other similar ones, etc. etc. Chick Bowen 00:37, 3 December 2007 (UTC)

Major_Stars (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (restore|cache|AfD)

Not sure why this should have been deleted, why is it not notable, I had links to citations that I thought backed up the notability of the topic, the band Major Stars.

The administrator NawlinWiki speedily deleted the article Major Stars, for asserted lack of "notability." I don't think the admin had time to read the material I linked to, from newspapers etc., or checked the links, which I think gives evidence of the bands notability. They come from the band Magic Hour which shared members of the legendary band Galaxie 500 (see the Misplaced Pages article), they run a legendary record store Twisted Village, they are now on the legendary indie record label Drag City (see the Misplaced Pages article), Wayne Rogers and Kate Village have put out many many records in the noise/improv category. Major Stars alone has released around six records. They where chosen by Thurston Moore of the world famous Sonic Youth to play a 2006 world All Tomorrow's Parties (music festival) concert (see the respective Misplaced Pages articles). They were called the "best rock band in the world" by the esteemed FADER music magazine. The world-famous Chicago Tribune (see Misplaced Pages article) newspaper agreed that they are the best rock band in the world. They toured with the famous Acid Mothers Temple (see the Misplaced Pages article) and have played with other famous bands . All Music Guide (see Misplaced Pages article) describes them as veterans of the Boston music scene. If you look at the links and do the research you will see how notable Major Stars are. I don't see anything on the speedy deletion list of criteria that I think justifies the speedy deletion of the Major Stars article. Let me know how it could be improved, but I don't think it should be deleted. What are other steps I can take to improve the article? Thanks.